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Post by Sue on Mar 6, 2021 10:38:01 GMT -5
I figured I'd also start a thread about all those who interviewed Lindbergh about the kidnapping from the earliest moments on March 1, 1932 to August 26, 1974.
Again, honestly, who obtained an interview?
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Post by Wayne on Mar 6, 2021 16:23:49 GMT -5
I figured I'd also start a thread about all those who interviewed Lindbergh about the kidnapping from the earliest moments on March 1, 1932 to August 26, 1974. Again, honestly, who obtained an interview? Sue, that's a great question, something I've been looking at for a long time! Here's all that I have: 1) CAL's initial statement on March 11, 1932 to NJSP (just one page and one sentence of a 2nd page). 2) FBI Agent Hugh Larimer’s interview of CAL (in or around January 30, 1933). 6 pages in which CAL gives various alternative accounts of the kidnapping. Very strange account given by CAL to the FBI. 3) CAL's trial testimony. 4) Not an interview, but 2 years after his death, CAL's Autobiography of Values was released. Of 400 pages recounting his life, CAL spent only 13 paragraphs summarizing the 3-year kidnapping. Among other things, he "remembered" grabbing his rifle, going outside under the nursery window, and seeing the ladder leaning against the house. I have no idea what to make of that. And that is all that I have on CAL's personal accounts of the kidnapping. If anyone has more, please post!
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Post by Sue on Mar 6, 2021 17:09:50 GMT -5
Thanks, Wayne.
Seth Moseley got an interview with Lindbergh soon after the kidnapping. Moseley retold that experience for Yankee Magazine in 1982.
There was also a reporter from an old Newport, Rhode Island family who was able to get an interview with Lindbergh about the kidnapping because of that reporter's family connections. His family owned one of those magnificent mansions on Bellevue Avenue. I printed out a webpage years ago, but can't recall his name right now. He was a poet, too.
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Post by IloveDFW on Mar 6, 2021 17:43:34 GMT -5
I figured I'd also start a thread about all those who interviewed Lindbergh about the kidnapping from the earliest moments on March 1, 1932 to August 26, 1974. Again, honestly, who obtained an interview? Sue, that's a great question, something I've been looking at for a long time! Here's all that I have: 1) CAL's initial statement on March 11, 1932 to NJSP (just one page and one sentence of a 2nd page). 2) FBI Agent Hugh Larimer’s interview of CAL (in or around January 30, 1933). 6 pages in which CAL gives various alternative accounts of the kidnapping. Very strange account given by CAL to the FBI. 3) CAL's trial testimony. 4) Not an interview, but 2 years after his death, CAL's Autobiography of Values was released. Of 400 pages recounting his life, CAL spent only 13 paragraphs summarizing the 3-year kidnapping. Among other things, he "remembered" grabbing his rifle, going outside under the nursery window, and seeing the ladder leaning against the house. I have no idea what to make of that. And that is all that I have on CAL's personal accounts of the kidnapping. If anyone has more, please post! Wayne, can you post Larimer's interview of CAL please???
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Post by Wayne on Mar 6, 2021 17:44:02 GMT -5
Thanks, Wayne. Seth Moseley got an interview with Lindbergh soon after the kidnapping. Moseley retold that experience for Yankee Magazine in 1982. There was also a reporter from an old Newport, Rhode Island family who was able to get an interview with Lindbergh about the kidnapping because of that reporter's family connections. His family owned one of those magnificent mansions on Bellevue Avenue. I printed out a webpage years ago, but can't recall his name right now. He was a poet, too. Sue, I had no idea about either interviews. Do you have these interviews? Can you post them here? Do you have Larimer's statement? I'll post it if you don't.
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Post by Wayne on Mar 6, 2021 17:45:33 GMT -5
Sue, that's a great question, something I've been looking at for a long time! Here's all that I have: 1) CAL's initial statement on March 11, 1932 to NJSP (just one page and one sentence of a 2nd page). 2) FBI Agent Hugh Larimer’s interview of CAL (in or around January 30, 1933). 6 pages in which CAL gives various alternative accounts of the kidnapping. Very strange account given by CAL to the FBI. 3) CAL's trial testimony. 4) Not an interview, but 2 years after his death, CAL's Autobiography of Values was released. Of 400 pages recounting his life, CAL spent only 13 paragraphs summarizing the 3-year kidnapping. Among other things, he "remembered" grabbing his rifle, going outside under the nursery window, and seeing the ladder leaning against the house. I have no idea what to make of that. And that is all that I have on CAL's personal accounts of the kidnapping. If anyone has more, please post! Wayne, can you post Larimer's interview of CAL please??? ILoveDFW, It looks like we posted at the same time. I'll post it soon...
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Post by Wayne on Mar 6, 2021 18:07:33 GMT -5
Here are the pertinent pages of the Larimer report. The first page is the cover page. The Lindbergh interview part starts near the bottom of page 4 and goes to page 10 (it will take 3 posts to attach them all) -- Attachment Deleted
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Post by Wayne on Mar 6, 2021 18:08:35 GMT -5
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Post by Wayne on Mar 6, 2021 18:09:36 GMT -5
Larimer report pages 9 & 10-
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Post by Sue on Mar 6, 2021 18:18:02 GMT -5
That is great that you posted the Larimer interview, but unfortunately I cannot see it.
Can you post some of the highlights of what Lindbergh said?
Thanks, Wayne.
I can post the Seth Moseley thread with links once I figure out how to do it!
I think it is a good thing to put these interviews all in one place!
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Post by Sue on Mar 6, 2021 18:23:08 GMT -5
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Post by Wayne on Mar 6, 2021 20:31:00 GMT -5
That is great that you posted the Larimer interview, but unfortunately I cannot see it. Can you post some of the highlights of what Lindbergh said? Thanks, Wayne. I can post the Seth Moseley thread with links once I figure out how to do it! I think it is a good thing to put these interviews all in one place! Here are a few highlights from Larimer's report. On page 4, Larimer states that “Agent (Larimer) and Colonel Lindbergh, in the absence of Barid, discussed the kidnapping case in private at the Morrow Estate. With that in mind, here are the things the Colonel Lindbergh informed Larimer: 1) That he, Anne, and Charlie arrived in Highfields “On Friday or Saturday night, February 26 or 27, 1932…” (How does CAL confuse the arrival date when the only time they spent a Friday night at Highfields was January 1, 1932?) 2) “On the week end in question, Mr. and Mrs. Whateley only were present at the Hopewell home upon the arrival of Colonel Lindbergh, his wife, and son.” (Why would CAL not mention Breckinridge, Mrs. Breckinridge, and Alva? CAL even drove Mr. and Mrs. Breckinridge there.) 3) “Betty Gow…did not arrive at the Hopewell residence until about 10:00 A.M., Tuesday, March 1, 1932, upon instruction of Mrs. Lindbergh.” (CAL and Anne supposedly were on the phone around that time discussing whether or not to send for Betty Gow. She arrived around 1:30 that afternoon.) 4) “He had a dinner speaking engagement for Tuesday night, March 1, 1932, in New York City, but forgot the engagement…” (That's the first time that I'm aware that CAL claimed he forgot. He usually blamed his secretary for giving him the wrong date.) 5) “The shutters on the east window in the nursery, next to the south, were warped and could not be secured by the hooks.” (Again this is CAL telling Larimer that the shutters were closed with hooks. CAL knew the shutters had sliding bolts.) (I know the above info may sound petty, but CAL goes on to describe the ladder in elaborate detail giving the original board dimensions, then their cut dimensions, and on and on with the minute details. He didn't miss a thing.) 6) “In the meantime, continuously, Betty Gow was either in the kitchen or the west parlor on the first floor from 8:00 P.M. to 10:00 P.M. The Whatelys (sic) were in the kitchen on the first floor during that period.” (According to both Betty and Elsie, they were in Elsie’s bedroom from 9:15 to 10:00. Is it possible that when this interview took place - 10 months after the kidnapping - that CAL wasn't aware of where everyone was that night? Not seeing it.) 7) “ Shortly after the discovery of the missing child, Red Johnson, Betty Gow’s friend, phoned) to her at the Hopewell residence.” (Red’s call to Highfields was at 8:47 when the Lindberghs were eating dinner; the baby was discovered missing at 10:00.) 8) “This note directed Condon to meet the writer, who was designated by the symbol above described, at the Rosemont Cemetery, Bronx.” (CAL was referring to the first meeting of CJ. It was at Woodlawn Cemetery, not Rosemont.)
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Post by IloveDFW on Mar 7, 2021 3:02:00 GMT -5
Here are the pertinent pages of the Larimer report. The first page is the cover page. The Lindbergh interview part starts near the bottom of page 4 and goes to page 10 (it will take 3 posts to attach them all) -- View AttachmentView AttachmentView AttachmentThanks Wayne, you rock! Anyone notice that CAL omitted the weekend guests at Highfields? The Breckenridges, their daughter who was babysitting Charlie, and their son. Also, after professing the innocence of especially Gow, but the Whateleys and the Morrow staff, would he say there could have been inside information? How could he know Red had an STD? This is all confusing. 🤯
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Post by Sue on Mar 7, 2021 4:14:19 GMT -5
Wayne,
Thanks for posting the highlights of Larimer's interview with Lindbergh.
What is the date of the interview? Did the interview take place soon after March 1?
Lindbergh's baby was missing. His first-born, biological child was gone. I wonder what that felt like for him? I wonder what that must have felt like to him neurologically, physiologically? I could just imagine the dread because even a few moments of not knowing where that baby was must have felt like an eternity.
Trauma manifests itself physically and mentally.
Maybe that could explain his answers to Larimer?
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Post by IloveDFW on Mar 7, 2021 8:57:34 GMT -5
Wayne, Thanks for posting the highlights of Larimer's interview with Lindbergh. What is the date of the interview? Did the interview take place soon after March 1? Lindbergh's baby was missing. His first-born, biological child was gone. I wonder what that felt like for him? I wonder what that must have felt like to him neurologically, physiologically? I could just imagine the dread because even a few moments of not knowing where that baby was must have felt like an eternity. Trauma manifests itself physically and mentally. Maybe that could explain his answers to Larimer? Hi Sue. Looks like the CAL interview was in 1933.
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Post by Wayne on Mar 7, 2021 11:08:52 GMT -5
Wayne, Thanks for posting the highlights of Larimer's interview with Lindbergh. What is the date of the interview? Did the interview take place soon after March 1? Lindbergh's baby was missing. His first-born, biological child was gone. I wonder what that felt like for him? I wonder what that must have felt like to him neurologically, physiologically? I could just imagine the dread because even a few moments of not knowing where that baby was must have felt like an eternity. Trauma manifests itself physically and mentally. Maybe that could explain his answers to Larimer? Hi Sue. Looks like the CAL interview was in 1933. I agree with you ILoveDFW... on page 10, at the bottom of the CAL interview, Larimer says: "He (CAL) apologized for the two day delay in reaching him (Larimer) on January 30, 1933, inasmuch as he thought he made it clear that Agent was to see him without delay.
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Post by Sue on Mar 7, 2021 11:09:43 GMT -5
Thank you for providing the date, IloveDF.
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Post by Sue on Mar 7, 2021 11:12:23 GMT -5
Sorry, meant to say thank you to IloveDFW.
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Post by Wayne on Mar 7, 2021 11:13:55 GMT -5
Wayne, Thanks for posting the highlights of Larimer's interview with Lindbergh. What is the date of the interview? Did the interview take place soon after March 1? Lindbergh's baby was missing. His first-born, biological child was gone. I wonder what that felt like for him? I wonder what that must have felt like to him neurologically, physiologically? I could just imagine the dread because even a few moments of not knowing where that baby was must have felt like an eternity. Trauma manifests itself physically and mentally. Maybe that could explain his answers to Larimer? Great question Sue. It looks like the Larimer interview took place 10 months after the kidnapping. I just find it strange that CAL did not remember that Mr. & Mrs. Breckinridge were at Highfields on the weekend prior to the kidnapping when he drove them there himself. And yet CAL could go into this minute detail regarding the ladder:
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Post by Sue on Mar 7, 2021 12:19:40 GMT -5
Maybe shocking life events forever alter a person's chemistry? PTSD doctors must understand this. Lindbergh probably had too much pride to be treated for the tremendous stress he must have been feeling. Could remembering minute details about the ladder, but not remembering that the Breckinridges were in Hopewell the last weekend in February be a classic sign of PTSD?
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Post by Sue on Mar 7, 2021 14:47:10 GMT -5
I wonder if Evelyn Shuler, of the Philadelphia Evening Public Ledger, was able to get an interview with Lindbergh?
The history buff dot com page about Miss Shuler, that was still around in 2013, seems to have been taken from the book called Ladies of the Press by Ishbel Ross. (1974)
Shuler was the supervisor of a group of male journalists at the time of the kidnapping. She seems to have been a tough woman, like Lorena Hickok.
Anyway, Shuler was able to get around the state troopers and into the Lindbergh mansion for two exclusive stories.
I wonder if Shuler was able to speak to Lindbergh?
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Post by Guest on Mar 7, 2021 15:37:24 GMT -5
I wonder if Evelyn Shuler, of the Philadelphia Evening Public Ledger, was able to get an interview with Lindbergh? The history buff dot com page about Miss Shuler, that was still around in 2013, seems to have been taken from the book called Ladies of the Press by Ishbel Ross. (1974) Shuler was the supervisor of a group of male journalists at the time of the kidnapping. She seems to have been a tough woman, like Lorena Hickok. Anyway, Shuler was able to get around the state troopers and into the Lindbergh mansion for two exclusive stories. I wonder if Shuler was able to speak to Lindbergh? Sue, this from page 131 of Ladies of the Press: "In addition to her extensive newspaper and club work Miss Shuler has written four books and contributed to the national magazines. She won a Bookman award for the best newspaper story taken from any paper in the world. It was a short piece about Mrs. Lindbergh, ripped out paragraph by paragraph from her machine, right on the deadline—which is the way that some of the best news stories have been written." [No date given and no mention of CAL.]
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Post by Sue on Mar 7, 2021 16:58:29 GMT -5
Hi Guest. Thanks for the passage from Ladies of the Press by Ishbel Ross. I think the Ross book may have been published in 1936, 1974 being a reprint. Anyway, the entire book can be accessed online simply by putting in the phrase "Ladies of the Press." The text is searchable, so you can put in her name: Evelyn Shuler. There is at least one reference to the case in that book. I will look later and post the reference. Here is the article by Rick Brown: web.archive.org/web/20131002193116/http://www.historybuff.com/library/refshuler.html
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Post by trojan on Mar 7, 2021 18:22:19 GMT -5
Wayne, Thanks for posting the highlights of Larimer's interview with Lindbergh. What is the date of the interview? Did the interview take place soon after March 1? Lindbergh's baby was missing. His first-born, biological child was gone. I wonder what that felt like for him? I wonder what that must have felt like to him neurologically, physiologically? I could just imagine the dread because even a few moments of not knowing where that baby was must have felt like an eternity. Trauma manifests itself physically and mentally. Maybe that could explain his answers to Larimer? All the while calling it "it" anytime the baby had to come up. And don't get me started on his horrendous behavior at the morgue or when "searching" for his kid.
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Post by Sue on Mar 8, 2021 21:09:11 GMT -5
Throughout the years, as I've perused newspapers from the 1930s, I've often read people referring to a baby as "it." Nothing sinister about it.
By the way when Prince Harry's son was born in May 2019, he was famously quoted as saying: "This little thing is absolutely to die for."
Someone could read wrongly into Harry's words, too.
What's better "it" or "thing"?
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Post by trojan on Mar 8, 2021 21:21:33 GMT -5
Throughout the years, as I've perused newspapers from the 1930s, I've often read people referring to a baby as "it." Nothing sinister about it. By the way when Prince Harry's son was born in May 2019, he was famously quoted as saying: "This little thing is absolutely to die for." Someone could read wrongly into Harry's words, too. What's better "it" or "thing"? Do most parents callously ask for a meat slicer when seeing their child's corpse or play practical jokes and card games while telling the world he was "searching"?
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Post by Sue on Mar 8, 2021 22:22:47 GMT -5
Sorry, trojan.
Don't be hostile.
I wasn't there at those scenes, and neither were you.
Do you feel that you got robbed of a good education?
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Post by Wayne on Mar 9, 2021 9:57:37 GMT -5
Throughout the years, as I've perused newspapers from the 1930s, I've often read people referring to a baby as "it." Nothing sinister about it. By the way when Prince Harry's son was born in May 2019, he was famously quoted as saying: "This little thing is absolutely to die for." Someone could read wrongly into Harry's words, too. What's better "it" or "thing"? Sue, I'm with you. For years it bothered me that CAL would call his son "it" but I've read somewhere (I'll try to find it) that CAL use "it" as a term of endearment the same way that he always referred to himself and his plane the Spirit of St. Louis as "We."
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Post by Michael on Mar 9, 2021 10:04:07 GMT -5
I wasn't there at those scenes, and neither were you. I think we should take a look at the options: 1. He wanted to impress upon the men in the room that he was not "weak."
2. He did not care about his son and viewed him more like road-kill than anything else.
3. Both 1 & 2.
4. This was normal behavior for that time.
5. He was in shock.
6. It was the only way he could identify him and felt obligated to take this action himself. Sue, I'm with you. For years it bothered me that CAL would call his son "it" but I've read somewhere (I'll try to find it) that CAL use "it" as a term of endearment the same way that he always referred to himself and his plane the Spirit of St. Louis as "We." I mentioned this in V3 on page 37. It comes from Waller. Frankly, I don't buy it. Did he refer to Anne as " it?" His mother? Any other person as " it?" If so, what did they look like? A Plane doesn't count and was in my opinion merely an excuse. In fact from my perspective, it supports the opposite by comparison.
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Post by IloveDFW on Mar 9, 2021 10:13:07 GMT -5
Wayne, Thanks for posting the highlights of Larimer's interview with Lindbergh. What is the date of the interview? Did the interview take place soon after March 1? Lindbergh's baby was missing. His first-born, biological child was gone. I wonder what that felt like for him? I wonder what that must have felt like to him neurologically, physiologically? I could just imagine the dread because even a few moments of not knowing where that baby was must have felt like an eternity. Trauma manifests itself physically and mentally. Maybe that could explain his answers to Larimer? Hi Sue! Am still searching, but a few years ago I posted about a dinner party where CAL WAS LAUGHING about that "New Jersey business" and making fun of some of the jury members. He did this at a table in front of other people less than two years after the kidnapping. I don't think he was all that traumatized. Most parents never get over the horror and pain. And in Anne's diaries and letters in the days immediately following March 1, she writes that CAL had never seemed happier and that while LE were exhausted, CAL slept most of the days.
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