kevkon
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Post by kevkon on May 11, 2008 15:26:06 GMT -5
I'm with you on the resolving of things, though I doubt it will ever occur. Too many hidden (and not so hidden) agendas in play.
The leak in Hauptmann's closet issue can be addressed in another way that would pretty much rule out that story.
BTW, I spent a lot of time in Newport as my roots are in Rhode Island. Nowadays the mansions are still open but the town has morphed into a yuppie upscale shopping extravaganza. I liked better when it still had some rough edges, good bars and seafood.
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 11, 2008 16:23:18 GMT -5
Ya when I was there last it was pretty trendy. Hilite of that trip was I saw that Smith guy (Kennedy cousin I think) in a Boston bar. You know - the guy that got in trouble in FL. I remember hating driving that bridge and the big Mak coming back, but then I guess I'm kind of a chicken - keep imagining the worst. On those bridges it's best to just close your eyes and floor it. We had nice weather for the mansion walk and it was pretty super. Nothing like a trip to Sturgis Rally which if you've never been here, don't bother. Kind of a big zoo - how to fit 400,000 people into a small town - but great shows - Queen will be her - maybe Dave too since he's working for them. So we could all get together and chat Lindbergh over a campfire until the Banditos started shooting at us because we were with Dave. Then Bob Mills (he's invited too) can open up about how it's similar to Lincoln because we are all sitting, and Michael can exclaim he knows more about Lincoln than anyone he knows, and we'll agree. Seriously, Bob, same invite to you if you want swing out to flyoverland, same for Rita and Joe and of course Michael. Few things are resolved but, in spite of my friendly notions, I have to state that if they are eventually resolved it's by people like you, Kevkon, and Michael, and Dave, and Joe, and Bob Mills, and surprisingly to you pehaps, Rita. She knows a lot of first hand about LKC that people are just ignoring. I believe she actually met Donovan (her Father was a German spy) and how many people nowdays can say that? When you say "too many agendas" does that have anything to do with the fact that some of the Lindbergh information is still classified and unavailable? Suggest more of a crime? Rita thinks so.
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on May 11, 2008 16:49:20 GMT -5
Unfortunately nothing that interesting. It's just the same old sorry Hauptmann did it alone ( lone wolf) versus the conspiracy group with a few people, who for some bizarre reason feel sorry for Hauptmann, thrown in for good measure. In short, it has absolutely nothing to do with actually solving a mystery. That's why so much time and energy gets spent on attacks and counterattacks, it's emotion at work in lieu of reason. Let the facts tell the story. As a famous architect was known to say "God is in the details". You either get that or you don't.
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 11, 2008 17:37:05 GMT -5
You bring up many interesting things. There is a "God" formula for architecture based mostly on a good look, but also a definate dimensional proportion contrast. Some things truly conflict with theories. If Hauptmann did it alone it was a billion to one chance that somehow worked. Say Hauptmann didn't do it alone but he didn't even know who he did it with except that they were bad - that would answer a lot of questions. Then we're back to square one without resolving anything in spite of all our gibberish. You did make me jealous with one post when you spoke of talking with clients - I miss them days, as Popeye would say, but he'd also say "I yam what I yam," and "we is us," so he and we all go down in history kind of like famous Yankee catchers. My nephew was a Yankee catcher for a while - speaking of politics! Lost his job in spite of super stats. Mattingly days - I sat next to Mattingly's wife (not bad) - another claim to fame.
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on May 12, 2008 6:29:27 GMT -5
The little details that often get cast aside and ignored can actually be more revealing than the big things that attract all of the attention. Those little details are usually free from manipulation and have a more direct link to the soul. In other words, they can reveal more about the true nature of an individual. The creators of Holmes and Columbo understood this.
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Joe
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Post by Joe on May 12, 2008 20:26:52 GMT -5
Uh guys, I believe the term you're referring to here should be "musty." To equate a bunch of dirty paper found in Hauptmann's garage with esox masquinongy is indeed a piscatorial affront of brobdingnagian proportion.
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 12, 2008 22:40:12 GMT -5
This is der Fuehrer speaking: Good point Joe. Musk refers to an animal smell and must is mold. Generalissimo Kevkon and I feel those are important things. Heretofore I will simply say that according to at least one source, most of the bills stunk. It's an important issue though, especially if they stunk prior to August of 1935, and I see Michael notes only Finn as claiming that - well who else was involved with the bills and would have claimed anything?
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 12, 2008 23:25:00 GMT -5
For Viceroy Kevkon: Michael did make a slip - did you notice it Kevkon, in the discussion of stink bills?
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on May 13, 2008 6:47:22 GMT -5
I think everyone has made a slip if you are referring to the musty oder of the bills in relation to the Fisch story and the leaky closet. That is the point here, right? If so I would suggest taking a trip upstream. There is to be found another of those small but important details that get overlooked. Here is a clue; From what source does the water come? ( be careful ) The answer will add another dimension to the question on which this thread started.
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Joe
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Post by Joe on May 13, 2008 10:45:55 GMT -5
To Fuehrer James McNeil Jack: I'm not sure what weapon you're referring to or if you did find it in the Ennui. Are you bluffing, Mein? I'm not up much on JTR but I can give you my take on what Sickert's saying in this painting. (brgtiger@gmail.com) I think there's a lot in there. Speaking of titles, do I sound like a Chancellor?
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 13, 2008 13:01:50 GMT -5
For Chancellor Joe: Wasn't in the painting - was a real knife (related to Sickert theory) which I thought you were talking about.. My earlier point was simply that other than the DNA Cornwell didn't bring up anything new except some medical suppositions which have no documentary support, and she didn't attribute her findings to their original authors. Her DNA analysis, by the way, though I agree with her, is far from the six billion to one statistics which we read about and normally think of DNA as being so exacting. It's closer to eighty to one when all issues are considered, but again I agree with her because of other contributing factors. I think Sickert perhaps would have liked being thought of as JTR, but the concept of him wandering around nights strangling or slicing people at sixty plus years of age is pretty thin (this is her later views of WS as he aged and she keeps after him). If you know anything about him you might agree that he was probably too lazy to be the Ripper. Seig!
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 15, 2008 3:41:15 GMT -5
For Michael: Reasonably and nicely I'd just like to bring up a quote from your earlier post and see what your logic tells you about it:
"The strong odor or stench SAID TO HAVE BEEN NOTICED on the 2980 amount...."
Now if something was "said to have been noticed" wouldn't it have been noticed priorly? Do you believe that information came from Finn? Why would Finn or anyone make up an odor about the bills? This FBI Lab Report is from August 1934 (your source). Just offhand doesn't that hint at an odor prior to August 1935? Why would Finn (or anyone) make something like that up when they had no idea the bills coming a year later would be musty smelling? Viceroy Kevkon and Chancellor Joseph think this should be resolved so we can move on to other odors.
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 15, 2008 4:00:41 GMT -5
For Viceroy Kevkon: I'm working on the bottom line of Zodiac: D E Z
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 15, 2008 4:01:00 GMT -5
I A
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 15, 2008 4:01:32 GMT -5
R N E
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 15, 2008 4:02:17 GMT -5
S S J R Can't figure it!
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 15, 2008 5:36:22 GMT -5
For Viceroy Kevkon and Chancellor Joseph: If you want to go secretive I can give you exculpatory information not brought out at trial about OJ and I would give you some Borden but for JTR I'd have to clear it with Bob Mills. Bob and I don't very often discuss what we know about Lindbergh but the above (FBI Aug 1934) is a nice new fact, and we are pretty secretive about other things. I'll tell you one thing, the true and exact solution to Lindbergh has not even been seriously considered here. Why would I do this? - So we get support instead of static on here.
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on May 15, 2008 5:43:06 GMT -5
Regarding the Zodiac's unsolved cryptograms, there is no solution. The guy was in the signal corp, he is playing with people's minds. That's his trip.
I'm surprised Jack. I wouldn't think you would be involved with a bad conspiracy author.
Support for what?
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 15, 2008 6:06:06 GMT -5
For Viceroy Kevkon: Boy will you be surprised.
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Post by Michael on May 15, 2008 6:09:33 GMT -5
Jack - tell me what you believe so that I can research a complimentary or rebuttal post. I can't research something from your perspective if you aren't giving it to me. I have (15) files on Ransom Money alone. Then there's the Summary Reports, mention of ransom in other core areas of investigation, Hoffman's Files, etc. etc.
Give me your position instead of beating around the bush and asking me questions you are implying you already know the answers to... I just don't have the time lately to go back and forth unnecessarily.
My post you reference was made to make a couple of points: That if the money smelled musty it didn't by April '34. As of right now only Finn is credited with making this claim, and he made another claim which turned out to be false (folded bill). And I suppose the most important being the bills Hauptmann had did smell musty in Sept. '34. I guess I am wondering how the smell disappears on one group but doesn't on another.
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on May 15, 2008 6:11:08 GMT -5
I doubt that Jack. There is nothing new about bad history, bad research, and bad writing. Check Amazon.com, they have a boatload! Why don't you contact a serious historian, like Dr. Gardner?
BTW, why didn't you answer my question regarding the source of the water? It holds a possibly vital clue regarding the condition of the notes.
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 15, 2008 6:44:50 GMT -5
For Duce Michael: Yes - I havn't been beating around the bush with you. I just brought up a simple thing about the money smell never being resolved. To myself it's resolved but I still don't see it resolved on here, but big deal - I have much bigger issues I can bring up. Frankly I(we) thought that this boards development would have resolved that issue (smelly money) so it was presented. That it wasn't certainly wasn't meant to cause you (Michael) anguish and I hope it really didn't. To say that I should lay out my wares about this particular case (LKC) is really kind of silly. I have my ideas and you have yours and Viscount Kevkon has his and Dave has his and Bob has his and we'll never all meet, but as issues come up or we bring them up, perhaps we can get together and agree once in a while. Especially Chancellor Joseph - you know he is REALLY smart. When he talks listen. And what about Rita's ideas? There's some ideas. I guess I'm not married to this place, but it would be nice if someone got into a corner instead of continued scrapping, they'd admit they were wrong or off base, and we're not really all jerks - we can all accept that. I told you a little earlier about how I did things when I was in business and a big part of that thinking was to not find fault - find solutions! For Viceroy Kevkon - Brother - I'll help ya - take my hand and look up to the lite - and see the long long trailer - and the mertzes in the distance - and brother take my hand!
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 15, 2008 6:49:07 GMT -5
For Viceroy Kevkon: I know the source of the water. Perhaps you don't - but please stop slamming my friends. I am a nice person and very polite and all, but if you get in trouble with us you get into some pretty substantial trouble - so lets keep it cool like it is!
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on May 15, 2008 12:40:14 GMT -5
Ok, what is it? Please tell me about it.
I am not slamming anyone. If I do you will definitely know it. Your "friend" put his ideas out for general consumption. Part of that deal is criticism. It's that simple. His arguments are very problematic and based on faulty logic and personal bias ,ie Hauptmann was a carpenter, the ladder is poorly built, therefore Hauptmann couldn't have made it. Sorry, it doesn't work that way.
That's okay Jack, I like trouble. Bring it on!
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on May 15, 2008 17:05:23 GMT -5
C'mon Jack of all Names, just got back from a job and was looking so forward to a reply on the water question ( or some trouble). Damn, what do I get, nothing!
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Post by Michael on May 15, 2008 17:19:45 GMT -5
So how's it resolved?
It hasn't caused me anguish. What I see you doing is claiming something without giving up any information to back it up. I can neither dispute nor compliment a claim that is made without any substance. You either already know the answers to the questions, think you know, or you're fishing.
Certainly, that is exactly what I am asking for. Anyone who has been at this for a while knows we can't assume anything. We must know it, and even then, there is something probably out there which can call that known fact into question.
I think everyone knows that particular smell on money is a very hard thing to get rid of. If "someone" said the J.J. Faulkner money smelled like that - was it all of the money, some of the money, or a few bills? Who said it? Why didn't it smell in April of '34? Why did Hauptmann's still smell in Sept. '34?
The general reference by the FBI Lab tells me they only "heard" of this. My experiences tell me this could have come from the newspapers. They were usually specific and did follow-ups on information like this. Here they don't.
I may indeed have these answers within my files. I don't know this information off the top of my head. My request to you is made so that I don't research a point nobody cares about or nobody made.
After reviewing my post I can see how it may appear that I came across as a little agitated. That wasn't my intent and I am sorry if it looked like that. I am not the best at getting my point across sometimes.
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 16, 2008 3:27:05 GMT -5
For Dulce Michael: No Michael, you didn't seem agitated. To my mind you are the perfect host. If I was upset - not particularly with you, but with others, I sincerely apologize and no jive. As the way of the world is, the musty money thing has all been said - all else is junk. I thank you for allowing me on this board and I will be a good trooper heretofore (is that a word Kevkon?). Jack
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 16, 2008 3:33:40 GMT -5
For Vinscount Kevkon: I kinda like Vinscount. Are you just trying to make me look stupid regarding the water? There's only two places it could have come from and it came from only one of those. Lets try to be friends - I will try. Jack
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on May 16, 2008 4:03:44 GMT -5
For Viscount Kevkon: I have no problem with you - u dreamin?
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on May 16, 2008 5:39:41 GMT -5
Of course not Jack. I just wanted to know where you thought the water came from. Simple, right? Actually Jack, there is more than two possible sources. But if we are talking about the closet/shoe box story, there is only one. I'm just trying to better understand the question you started with this thread. To do that I wanted to know how you felt the money got wet. So what do you think happened (or didn't)? Why is it always so hard to get a simple straightforward answer ?
Jack, you wanna be friends? No problem.
BTW, your author friend made a fairly significant incorrect statement of fact in his Booth post ( that was a nice way of saying mistake). As a friend you should alert him to it. You don't want him to look bad. I mean, if a carpenter can notice it ,imagine what the really smart people will be able to do.
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