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JAFSIE
Apr 28, 2014 15:12:07 GMT -5
Post by patrickflynn on Apr 28, 2014 15:12:07 GMT -5
Hey all,
They're scattered throughout all the different books so i was hoping to get them all in one place. Does anyone have a sequential list of all the 'jafsie ' placed in the NY American during the kidnapping negotiations? Starting from March 11 until the final one after the search for Nelly? This would be very helpful to me. I'd appreciate it. also, unrelated, anyone care to speculate about Nosovitskys grudge against the Faulkners/Giesslers?
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JAFSIE
Apr 28, 2014 17:51:58 GMT -5
Post by Michael on Apr 28, 2014 17:51:58 GMT -5
They're scattered throughout all the different books so i was hoping to get them all in one place. Does anyone have a sequential list of all the 'jafsie ' placed in the NY American during the kidnapping negotiations? Starting from March 11 until the final one after the search for Nelly? This would be very helpful to me. I'd appreciate it. It's best to list them all. First step is to look over this document for the dates and who actually placed them (it's source is Breckenridge): Let me point out the one error I have found... AD #1 was not called in over the phone by Rosner - he actually walked into the Office at 323 West 4th Street then placed the ad in person. Also, it ran on both the 8th and 9th. AD(s) #1: Letter received at new address. Will follow your instruction. I also received letter mailed to me March 4, and was ready since then. Please hurray on account of mother. Address me to the address you mention in your letter. Father. AD(s) #2: Money is ready. Jafsie.AD(s) #3: I accept. Money is ready. You know they won't let me deliver without getting the package. Let's make it some sort of C.O.D. Transaction. Come. You know you can trust Jafsie.AD(s) #4: Inform me how I can get important letter to you. Jafsie.AD(s) #5: Thanks. That little package you sent was immediately delivered and accepted as real article. See my position. Over fifty years in business and can I pay without seeing goods? Common sense makes me trust you. Please understand my position. Jafsie.AD(s) #6: Money is ready. Furnish simple code for us to use in paper. Jafsie.AD(s) #7: I accept. Money is ready. Jafsie.AD(s) #8: Yes. Everything O.K. Jafsie.AD(s) #9: What is wrong? Have you crossed me? Please better directions. Jafsie.
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Deleted
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JAFSIE
Apr 29, 2014 11:20:45 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2014 11:20:45 GMT -5
This is a very interesting way to look at the ransom negotiations. Most of the are placed by Henry Breckinridge's secretary. The two exceptions I see are Ad#1 placed by Rosner and then Ad#4 which is placed by Captain William M. Galvin.
So, Michael, who is Captain Galvin??
About Ad#1:
AD(s) #1: Letter received at new address. Will follow your instruction. I also received letter mailed to me March 4, and was ready since then. Please hurray on account of mother. Address me to the address you mention in your letter. Father
This is the first newspaper response to the ransom notes. This runs March 8 and 9. It is in response to the first mailed ransom note received at the Hopewell house on Saturday March 5 and the ransom letter received at Breckinridge's office March 7. I find it interesting that Lindbergh/Breckinridge say that they have been ready since the March 4 letter that came to Hopewell. I wondered if this meant they were ready to pay the ransom ($70,000) so they could get Charlie back quickly. So when I did some checking I found in Lloyd Gardner's book, The Case That Never Dies on page 46 that F.D. Bartow, a J.P. Morgan partner had already assembled the $70,000 dollars the kidnappers were demanding and had it ready to send down to Hopewell. The way the text reads, it sounds like the money assembly is taking place on March 5. Breckinridge is back in New York on Saturday the fifth. Rosner runs up there too with the second ransom note to show Breckinridge and hooks up with Bitz and Spitale and they all go over to Bartow's place. After eating some lunch they all are brought down to Hopewell by N.J State Trooper escort. The $70,000 ransom money is with them. The ransom money is ready to be paid when Ad#1 appears in the paper on March 8. The ad wants the kidnappers to hurry their response and address the response to the "address you mention in your letter." That address is Col. Breckinridge's office. Instead of a response coming to Breckinridge, John F. Condon's letter to the Bronx Home News appears on March 8 and the kidnappers respond to his letter on March 9.
If the ransom money was assembled and ready, the go-between is selected by the kidnappers and accepted by Lindbergh and Breckinridge, the "money is ready" ad is placed in the papers March 11, then why doesn't Condon have the money with him the night of March 12?
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Deleted
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JAFSIE
Apr 29, 2014 11:29:25 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2014 11:29:25 GMT -5
Could you comment on what this grudge is? I have no knowledge about such a grudge.
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Deleted
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JAFSIE
Apr 29, 2014 17:28:36 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2014 17:28:36 GMT -5
When reading through the list of Breckinridge made, I noticed that there are a few not mentioned by him. I am specifically referring to the "Baby is alive and well. Money is ready. Call and see us." ad that Jafsie ran in the Bronx Home News on Sunday March 13. There is also the ad that Jafsie ran on Monday March 13 saying "Money is Ready. No cops, No secret service, No press. I come alone like last time. Jafsie". Was Breckinridge in agreement with these two being run since he doesn't mention them in his list or is Condon acting on his own with these ? When Condon showed up empty-handed at Woodlawn when CJ was clearly expecting the money to be brought to that meeting, perhaps Breck and/or Condon were worried that they might have made a mistake having Condon show up without the money in hand.
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JAFSIE
Apr 29, 2014 18:28:56 GMT -5
Post by Michael on Apr 29, 2014 18:28:56 GMT -5
So, Michael, who is Captain Galvin?? He was the Executive Secretary to the Navy League in Washington D.C. - and had been when Breckenridge was President from 1919 to 1921. (see: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navy_League_of_the_United_States) Rosner called him Breckenridge's " Confidant" and the FBI explained his presence during this phase as a friend and private citizen having been brought into the case to assist Breckenridge in keeping track of its many angles. ( Summary Report p. 145).
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Deleted
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JAFSIE
May 2, 2014 15:46:06 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on May 2, 2014 15:46:06 GMT -5
Thanks for your input here. I went and read the FBI summary pages on him. He must be the Galvin that Rosner accused of being a leak in the case. I think Rosner also accused Breck's private investigator named Fogarty of being a possible leak. There were so many people involved with this case sometimes it makes my head spin!
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JAFSIE
May 3, 2014 6:39:06 GMT -5
Post by Michael on May 3, 2014 6:39:06 GMT -5
Thanks for your input here. I went and read the FBI summary pages on him. He must be the Galvin that Rosner accused of being a leak in the case. I think Rosner also accused Breck's private investigator named Fogarty of being a possible leak. There were so many people involved with this case sometimes it makes my head spin! Isn't it fascinating that Rosner believed someone on the inside was leaking information? There's a lot of interesting people involved with this case who don't get much mention. For me, its important to look at everyone connected to see where it leads us. Fogarty had been a Detective working for the DA's Office when Breckenridge's brother was Asst. DA there. What's most interesting to me, was that Fogarty had at one time started a Private Investigation partnership with the famous Felix Di Martini. De Martini, or sometimes spelled "Di Martini," was considered a top-notch Detective when he was with the NYPD Homicide Detective Bureau. He had become famous when he was hired by Mrs. Hall then accused of Witness Tampering in that case.... It becomes an extremely tangled web if one continues to dive deeper into these things. In any event, Breckenridge trusted him and as a result asked for his help. One report mentioned he was brought on as Lindbergh's "bodyguard" but this was swiftly refuted in NY Times article almost immediately. (Apparently, "Superman" didn't like that suggestion being presented to the public.) Unfortunately, Fogarty's involvement didn't last long - he died of a heart attack at the age of 51 in late December of '32.
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kdwv8
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JAFSIE
May 3, 2014 8:22:23 GMT -5
Post by kdwv8 on May 3, 2014 8:22:23 GMT -5
Unfortunately, Fogarty's involvement didn't last long - he died of a heart attack at the age of 51 in late December of '32. Don't you find it odd how many people who were involved with the case died not long after the "kidnapping"?
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JAFSIE
May 3, 2014 9:08:37 GMT -5
Post by Michael on May 3, 2014 9:08:37 GMT -5
Don't you find it odd how many people who were involved with the case died not long after the "kidnapping"? From everything I've read I find it unusual people weren't dropping sooner. It's kind of like what we are seeing now with all the Heroin related deaths. People are "surprised" by it. Why? What I see is this far-left liberal idea that its perfectly fine to experiment with drugs constantly being presented to the public. The consequence for unhealthy choices are very real. What should be "pushed" is responsible behavior, accountability, and self discipline. But instead we see addiction, crime, and death - the cause for which is supposedly not the individual who made that choice. I know I am going off on a tangent... I read a platform from a Liberal Democrat in Trenton recently saying that everyone should be able to sit on their front porch then be able to smell the fresh air and not "weed." Isn't it funny? This is exactly what her counterparts in other parts of the country want. And in New Jersey "weed" is still illegal. Anyway no. I really think people ate anything, drank anything, smoked cigarettes from dawn till dusk, and were far less heath conscious without the benefit of modern medicine.
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Deleted
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JAFSIE
May 3, 2014 11:43:15 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on May 3, 2014 11:43:15 GMT -5
Yes I do considering that Rosner had a copy of the ransom note and he took it to New York and shared it with Owney Madden and others in the underworld. Sounds like a big leak to me. What astounds me even more is that he was allowed to do this. Even if the thinking was that the mob was involved then it would not be necessary to allow the ransom note to be made available in this way.
No doubt Breckinridge did trust both Galvin and Fogarty. I really don't think that trust was misplaced either. If these men leaked anything, it would have been by design. I think Rosner became jealous of these men and tried to discredit them in Breck's eyes so he started accusing them of leaking information. Didn't do him any good. His undoing came with the arrival of the mysterious Dr. Stice!
Lindbergh having a bodyguard??? Now that is funny!!!!
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Deleted
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JAFSIE
May 4, 2014 14:54:25 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on May 4, 2014 14:54:25 GMT -5
Decided to do a little checking around on this whole "bodyguard" issue. Interestingly, Lindbergh did have a bodyguard assigned to him. Lloyd Gardner says in his book The Case That Never Dies on page 118, that Lieutenant James J. Finn of the New York Police Department served as Lindbergh's bodyguard on his return from the "Lone Eagle" flight in 1927. Would you know, Michael, whose idea it was to have a bodyguard assigned to Lindbergh at this time?
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JAFSIE
May 5, 2014 17:16:57 GMT -5
Post by patrickflynn on May 5, 2014 17:16:57 GMT -5
Could you comment on what this grudge is? I have no knowledge about such a grudge. My understanding of Behn's book was that Noso used the address listed on the Faulkner deposit slip as a direct reference to Jane Faulkner to send some heat their way (on top of his affinity for the use of the 'J.J' initials and the name 'Faulkner' as a pseudonym) - also there was some business about the stolen car he left there tying to them in some fashion? I'm a little hazy. Please correct me if im wrong it's a very dense chapter in the book. Now that I'm back on the boards may as well ask if anyone came across the Schwarzkopf memo Mark told me about- that is the one where it says "if you find anymore ransom money burn it". Michael? Anybody? Also, in reference to the whole "Capt. Galvin" thing- he was Breck's equivalent to Condon's Reich- what's interesting is Greg Coleman's "Vigil" references a Capt. Dalton and 'Calvin' (prolly spelling error) So, who's Dalton then?
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JAFSIE
May 5, 2014 17:28:28 GMT -5
Post by Michael on May 5, 2014 17:28:28 GMT -5
Decided to do a little checking around on this whole "bodyguard" issue. Interestingly, Lindbergh did have a bodyguard assigned to him. Lloyd Gardner says in his book The Case That Never Dies on page 118, that Lieutenant James J. Finn of the New York Police Department served as Lindbergh's bodyguard on his return from the "Lone Eagle" flight in 1927. Would you know, Michael, whose idea it was to have a bodyguard assigned to Lindbergh at this time? From what I understand, Finn was assigned to the Security Detail involved with the Ticker Tape Parade thrown for Lindbergh down Broadway. In the car with Lindbergh was Grover Whalen and Mayor Beau James. Supposedly Finn was in charge of this detail, and I would assume the idea originated from whichever Police Commisioner was in charge at the time (either George Vincent McLaughlin or Joseph A. Warren).
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JAFSIE
May 5, 2014 18:34:13 GMT -5
Post by Michael on May 5, 2014 18:34:13 GMT -5
Now that I'm back on the boards may as well ask if anyone came across the Schwarzkopf memo Mark told me about- that is the one where it says "if you find anymore ransom money burn it". Michael? Anybody?
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JAFSIE
Sept 16, 2019 18:22:16 GMT -5
Post by patrickflynn on Sept 16, 2019 18:22:16 GMT -5
Hi all - was hoping to get any kind of h-res images of any of the JAFSIE or and other pertinent headlines in the case - as I'm doing a art collage on the subject. Any files would be much obliged.
Best PJF
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jack7
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JAFSIE
Sept 16, 2019 21:03:00 GMT -5
Post by jack7 on Sept 16, 2019 21:03:00 GMT -5
That's ridiculous, Michael/ Without modern medicine, life expectancies would be about twenty years earlier. It's easy to find the statistics. On a Browns update, Odell is out - medical, but Browns look like a winner.
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JAFSIE
Sept 17, 2019 7:33:08 GMT -5
Post by Michael on Sept 17, 2019 7:33:08 GMT -5
Hi all - was hoping to get any kind of h-res images of any of the JAFSIE or and other pertinent headlines in the case - as I'm doing a art collage on the subject. Any files would be much obliged. Best PJF Unfortunately, I don't have any hi-res scans of this type. Most of my stuff like this are from the xerox machine: imgur.com/wH4YJwPimgur.com/RJiiO2mSomeone here might have something, but I'd refer you to Mark at the archives who I am certain could help you out.
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JAFSIE
Sept 19, 2019 9:45:55 GMT -5
Post by wolfman666 on Sept 19, 2019 9:45:55 GMT -5
I have a original place card ad that stores put in the front windows to tell you what was in the current issue of liberty at the time. don't know if that image would help
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