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Post by crag on Aug 19, 2011 16:56:42 GMT -5
This map at "Wikimapia" purports to show approximately where the baby's remains were found: wikimapia.org/11153168/Lindbergh-Baby-Body-Discovery-Approximate-SiteIs this accurate? I know there is an "Old Mt. Rose Road" that forks off just a bit north of this point, so I'm wondering if was found off to the west side from the older road. When was the current road built?
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Post by wolf2 on Aug 20, 2011 7:07:30 GMT -5
when i went there in the early 90s there was a marker. but since then when i went, its gone
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Post by Michael on Aug 20, 2011 7:43:59 GMT -5
That looks about right... Attachments:
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Post by kae on Aug 21, 2011 14:30:12 GMT -5
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on Aug 21, 2011 14:50:14 GMT -5
Who cares? The death of the child that close to the property shows that it was a hit, and a hate crime. You people looking into this thing just don't want to admit it. Who could kill the most loved child in the United States? Duane Baker that's who - this whole thing has been figured out but you guys won't accept it. You dis Rick and Rita who have some answers and go on wondering about the ladder or Betty or some jive. He, as unlikely as is seems it had to be Roosevelt - FDR, with BRH as the fall guy. That's why it's still an enigma and has never been figured out except by me. I also figured out JFK - e me and I'll tell you about that.
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Post by crag on Aug 21, 2011 15:17:54 GMT -5
Thank you for posting the trooper's report. That is very interesting. It corresponds with an AP photo I was looking at. You can see it at www.apimages.com/It is image number 360329057 . You can enter that number into the search function and get to the image. I'm wary of uploading these copyright-marked images. It shows the area taken from a plane. You can see one of the fences up in the upper right corner of the image. The photo has an X marking the location where the body was found, but it indicates a different location than what the trooper indicates. I suspect the trooper is more accurate and the AP photo contains information intended to mislead the public. I think the trooper's location would corresponded with shadow of the tail of the plane in the AP photo. Other photos of the location are numbered 320515019 , 320513093 . and 320514038 . One of those taken from the road shows the fences on both sides of the road, and is interesting that it shows a line of trees on the right farther down the road. When I look at 1930 aerial photographs of the area from this site: njstateatlas.com/1930/- it shows that the road at that time was already following the route of the current road. It also shows no line of trees near the area drawn out on the Wikimedia map. I think it likely the site was about a quarter or third of mile farther south down the road from where indicated on the Wikimedia map. It'd be nice to see a current aerial view of the location taken during winter, where you could see and compare the current streams to the old ones.
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Post by Michael on Aug 21, 2011 18:30:04 GMT -5
Kae: Thanks for the link to these pictures. I haven't been to that site before.
Crag: Great stuff... Especially the 1930's map. Many Police reports get the streets wrong. So its important to note that if/when you read a report.
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on Aug 22, 2011 8:24:41 GMT -5
It's great to see the interest in evidence. Nice work! Crag, you can see what you are looking for on the NJ map site under Topo.
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Post by crag on Aug 22, 2011 12:37:31 GMT -5
I found an aerial view in NJ water resources that I think corresponds with the old photographs. This url will point to the spot on an aerial view and I think puts a blue dot about where the trooper indicated the body was found. tinyurl.com/3f5xcsuThis area is very close to where I thought it should be, and has that distinctive straight stream or gulley that runs in almost a straight line from the side of the road. I couldn't make any sense of the system's coordinates: Easting X = 422,752 Northing Y = 562,047 So I had to do the best I could by measuring and comparing with Google Earth. I think the area the trooper indicated is near 40.376143 -74.749146 as indicated on Google Earth, and the AP photo mark is near 40.376480 -74.748932 note the visible guard rail and utility poles in the water resources aerial photo. The location is 1.08 miles south from the road's junction with Rt. 518 in Hopewell. There is a long run of guardrail that ends at this point in the road. I think if you went back into the woods about 33 feet from the end of the guardrail you'd be close to the spot indicated in the AP photo. If you were at the first utility pole just south of where the guardrail ends and went back into the woods about 73 feet, I think that is close to where the trooper indicated on his hand drawn map. You can copy and paste these coordinates into the "Fly To" window in Google Earth (a free program) and it will take you to the spot indicated. And Google has a "street view" function where cars have taken 360-degree images while going down streets and roads, and see what the roadway looks like today (or at least what it looked like when the streetview car went down that way). Google Maps may do the same, but I'm not familiar with that website.
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Post by kevkon on Aug 22, 2011 13:19:31 GMT -5
40.376118,-74.748595 is correct. There is a catch basin about 15' from a telephone pole.
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on Aug 22, 2011 14:02:09 GMT -5
Hey Kev, why does it matter where exactly the babys body was found? This seems just one of the idiosyncracies that you and Michael waste limitless hours on. Hey, how many hours have you two looked at the ladder? So it was a heme made or business made ladder meant to be mounted on a structure. Not a weight bearing ladder. So somebody would choose that only because they would have it handy and be really stupid to use it (probably using it of necessity.) So Bruno is told when to build the ladder, Baker knows where to get in, Baker kills the kid because Roosevelt wants Lindbergh out of the Presidential picture, and CAL moves out of USA to save he and his wife's butts. It's the only answer which fits for an enigma many years old.
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Post by crag on Aug 22, 2011 14:35:56 GMT -5
I can see the catch basins on both sides of the road in Google Earth street view. Do you suppose they correspond with the two fences in the old photographs, indicating where the stream was passed at an angle under the roadway? That would make sense.
As to why it matters: Why does anything matter? If it interests you, it matters. It might matter if you wanted to put in a historical marker, and didn't want to put in the wrong place. Once upon a time that little area of dirt ground was at the center of the collective mind of the nation, if not the world, and now it is an unmarked and forgotten bit of ground again. Besides that, it's a crime scene, and that would surely be relevant to any discussions here.
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Post by jack7 on Aug 22, 2011 14:53:50 GMT -5
We're talking about a crime here crag - So this thing was pulled off nicely and if the baby was left twelve centimeters from where the police said it was left doesn't mean anything. You seem to be like Kevkon and Michael who would rather chase windmills than solve this thing.
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Post by Michael on Aug 22, 2011 16:26:25 GMT -5
I am with you here. Your posts are valuable.
I agree. If Jack thinks we're going in the wrong direction that's fine too - but I don't agree with him.
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Post by kevkon on Aug 22, 2011 16:36:11 GMT -5
I can see the catch basins on both sides of the road in Google Earth street view. Do you suppose they correspond with the two fences in the old photographs, indicating where the stream was passed at an angle under the roadway? That would make sense. Yes Keep going, there's always more to find. Look at Old Mount Rose Road (as it was in 1932) Other things of interest; the sightlines on Hopewell Princeton Rd at the time, the topography, the aerial view of Highfields and the immediate vicinity in 1932. There are many things that become clear when you look through an old lens. Did you check out D&R Greenway Land Trust?
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jack7
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Post by jack7 on Aug 23, 2011 5:23:18 GMT -5
Your site is absolutely upgoofed Michael!
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Post by jack7 on Aug 23, 2011 5:58:49 GMT -5
Just as a very good example of how stupid everything is nowdays, lets take Omar Quidafi. Now the United States spent about twenty billion dollars trying to find him for over ten years. Beside the fact that why did they want to find him anyway (there is only one short tape expressing his interest in 911, not claiming to have done it - and who wasn't interested in 911?) so if we're really after this guy I could do it with four seals, and save the government billions. For one thing, he was on a kidney dialisis machine and the chemicals nessary to support that machine were only available from one source. So, follow that source and find him. But they never did that. That, over time, is the kind of thing that makes me know this, and everything is just a bunch of jive - Lindbergh mostly, and Hoffa did Kennedy and Kennedy paid back.
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Post by jack7 on Aug 23, 2011 6:27:45 GMT -5
Hey Michael, the way all police look at large crime is that they know what a guy like say Capone would do, but if they dusted Capone which they could do easily, then what's the next guy gonna do? So it's kind of a win win for the police to not get rid of major criminals. Capone was gotten by IRS, not regular police you'll recall. Bonnie & Clyde were turned in by her father - the police never actually found them. Dillinger was turned. Others were turned - but the police never find anybody because they don't want to (see above) and Walsh is about the best example that I can think of regarding that matter!
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Post by wolf2 on Aug 23, 2011 6:48:54 GMT -5
i get a kick at my pictures, where sombody put a hot dog stand across from the site
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Post by jack7 on Aug 23, 2011 7:33:50 GMT -5
This is a serious crime here wolf. I don't think Michael and Kevkon appreciate your jiving it like that. In other words - you're cool.
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Post by kevkon on Aug 23, 2011 9:31:17 GMT -5
Jack, is this really the best you can offer? Are you that desperate for attention?
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Post by jack7 on Aug 23, 2011 13:24:48 GMT -5
You have said that before Kev - I give conclusions, you keep coming up with questions that don't exist.
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Post by kevkon on Aug 23, 2011 16:06:36 GMT -5
You have said that before Kev - I give conclusions, you keep coming up with questions that don't exist. Kinda reminds me of someone I know who is very troubled and after visiting a string of therapists with no success proclaimed to me that the problem was that " he had the answers and just needed the questions". My reply;" how's that working out for you" I would suggest that if you have all of the answers a book might be in order, or perhaps a reality show. For myself and those who still have plenty of questions the forum provides an opportunity to share and debate. Crag has started a thread on the child's location and in doing so researched and found excellent source information which I am sure many have never seen. When you look closely at these period photos there's a wealth of information to be discovered. At the same time it may simultaneously provide both answers and new questions. That is if you have an open mind. If you don't, it really doesn't matter since you probably have all the answers anyway.
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Post by jack7 on Aug 23, 2011 20:05:32 GMT -5
Hey Kev, I am not at you, or at Mike - don't get that part wrongly, but it does seem that some things are concluded which keep geiinng discussed. The body is a great example and brings up the example of a real crime. If we go by Walsh this thing would have been exactly over long ago - should we go by Walsh, Kev?
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Post by kevkon on Aug 24, 2011 8:31:59 GMT -5
I never said I thought you were at me or Michael. It wouldn't matter in any case as we are both capable of dealing with that. Ok, if you believe Walsh had the answers, why not start a thread on that basis and elaborate? This tread was started by Crag and pertains to the location of the body. If you have some relevant info on that, feel free to share it. There is a protocol regarding forums and being respectful of a thread and the poster is one of them.
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Post by kjones on Aug 24, 2011 13:08:36 GMT -5
WOW! Thank you Crag for your post. Now I understand when locals said you could see right into the house when the lights were on. What I have never been able to understand is the theory that the kidnapper parked on Featherbed and hiked in/out. In these pictures the terrain from Featherbed to the Lindbergh home seems challenging under the best of conditons, let a dark, cold windy night.. Is it correct that the distance between the home and road is a quarter mile? I have a grandson who just turned two, I can't imagine carrying him over that terrain awake, drugged or well you know. Your post Crag has made me wonder how anyone alone could have thought they would succeed in this crime.
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Post by crag on Aug 24, 2011 14:32:08 GMT -5
Question for Wolf2 (or anyone that knows):
You said there was a marker once, and later it was gone? What was it like? A full-fledged bronze marker on a stand? A wooden sign? Professional-looking or home-made? I'm curious.
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Post by crag on Aug 24, 2011 15:45:18 GMT -5
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Post by wolf2 on Aug 24, 2011 18:01:58 GMT -5
i have a picture of it i think it was silver, a aluminum pole
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Post by kevkon on Aug 25, 2011 7:40:55 GMT -5
FWIW, there is a book on Hopewell which has various residents recounting the history they lived through. There is, as would be expected, LKC related stories. Anyway, one recounts how the local citizens used to get a kick out of visitors coming to see where the child was found and how the it was completely mismarked. If you look at Crag's first posting you can see this.
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