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Post by sue75 on Aug 28, 2011 13:15:38 GMT -5
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Post by sue75 on Oct 30, 2011 13:34:08 GMT -5
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Post by sue75 on Nov 23, 2011 19:20:46 GMT -5
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Post by sue75 on Nov 23, 2011 19:30:24 GMT -5
The startlingpage-turnerwith, finally, thegroundbreakingtrue story behindthe Lindberghkidnapping90• National Review Attention• Off the Book Page CoverageFROM cRAdLE TO gRAVE:
Is it possible that with the full force of the New Jersey State Police, the New York CityPolice Department, and J. Edgar Hoover’s Federal Bureau of Investigation on his heels,an uneducated delicatessen clerk had perpetrated the “Crime of the Century,” then evadedcapture for the rest of his life? What reason might this man have had to involve himself insuch a nefarious act? As I set out to answer these questions, the truth turned out to be stranger than I ever expected. . . . -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Page 92 the overlook pressCRADLE TO GRAVEThe Undiscovered Mastermind Behind the Lindbergh KidnappingROBERT zORNFor seventy-five years, the kidnapping and murder of CharlesLindbergh’s infant son has gone unsolved. Evidence, opin-ion, and logic have discredited the notion that Bruno RichardHauptmann—electrocuted in 1936—acted alone. In this meticu-lous and authoritative account of the crime, the trial, and thetimes of the Lindbergh kidnapping, Robert Zorn clears awaydecades of ungrounded speculation surrounding the case. Inspiredby his father’s relationship with the actual accomplices—includ-ing the mastermind—he presents the clearest ever picture of acriminal partnership, which would shake every class and cultureof American society.Using personal possessions and documents, never-before-seen photographs, new forensic evidence, and extensive research,Robert Zorn has written a shocking and captivating account of thecrime and the original “Trial of the Century.”From the ecstatic riots that followed the Spirit of St. Louison either side of the Atlantic, to the tragic night that would shakeAmerica’s sense of security, to the horror of the New Jersey morguewhere Lindbergh insisted on verifying the identity of his son,Zorn’s skillful treatment meets this larger-than-life story and givesit definitive shape—revealing the true story behind the crime, forthe first time.Photo: Jean WozniakRobert zorn is a graduate ofDuke University and the WhartonSchool of Business. His uniquequalification to tell this story is hisrelationship to his father, the lateEugene C. Zorn, Jr., a nationallyrespected economist, and the onlyperson who ever witnessed theconspiracy behind the kidnapping.978-1-59020-856-4$26.95 ($31.00 CAN)True Crime16 b/w illustrations6 x 9 304 pp.Export rights: V00Agent: William Callahan @ InkWell ManagementFirst Serial, Audio, UK, Translation: OverlookJUNE91
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Post by bookrefuge on Dec 22, 2011 11:08:48 GMT -5
Unless I missed it before, it looks like Zorn’s book is no longer entitled Cradle to Grave but is now: Cemetary John: The Undiscovered Mastermind Behind the Lindbergh Kidnappingwww.amazon.com/Cemetary-John-Undiscovered-Mastermind-Kidnapping/dp/1590208560/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1324556531&sr=8-10Hopefully they will get the word “Cemetery” spelled right before publication. They are keeping a tight lid on the identity of Zorn’s “mastermind”—which is a little disappointing, but I can understand it from a marketing standpoint. The only hint we can glean so far is that he was an “uneducated delicatessen clerk.” Michael, do we have anybody connected with the LKC who matches that description? Incidentally, I see that Zorn is a fan of Jim Fisher’s books: jimfisher.edinboro.edu/reviews/lindyr.htmlAllegedly Zorn himself knows the truth about the Lindbergh case because his father personally knew the real kidnappers. Interesting, then, that he praised Fisher’s books for “rare commitment to truth” in 2003. I haven’t read Fisher’s books, but doesn’t he essentially say BRH did it by himself? But maybe Zorn just admired Fisher’s qualities as a writer, not his ultimate conclusion? Or Zorn’s father hadn’t yet let him in on the “real scoop”?
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Post by Michael on Dec 23, 2011 16:51:46 GMT -5
There were so many people who, in one way or another, have been associated with this case. So its really hard to say who he is talking about - could be anybody really. If I were to take a wild guess it could be Albert Diebig. If you remember, this is who Hauptmann was looking for when he first got to the U.S. It's the guy who was going to California with him during the 1st Car he purchased that broke down. The two of them were always thinking up ways to make easy money.... like making soap. At one point they went 50/50 on a lunch-type business at $400 each. Hauptmann would later sell his half to Diebig for $800 doubling his money.
This is why I am guessing Diebig.
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mairi
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Post by mairi on Dec 23, 2011 18:22:58 GMT -5
Merry! Merry, everyone! Happy 2012! (with apologies to "Robert Zorn" for borrowing his thread
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Post by Michael on Dec 24, 2011 19:22:40 GMT -5
Thanx Mairi. Right back at you, and to everyone else.
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Post by bookrefuge on Jan 9, 2012 16:59:36 GMT -5
This is really minor, but since we’ve been speculating on the identity of Zorn’s unrevealed mastermind-- a “deli clerk”--I’ll quote the FBI Files (p. 424): “Berritella has a brother who lives in Yonkers, where he conducts a retail grocery store.” Peter Birritella was always somewhat suspect, as he seemed to have knowledge about the LKC that went beyond claimed supernatural revelations. And he ran a temple attended by several principals in the LKC, including Violet Sharp, whom Anna Bonesteel testified was engaged in suspicious activity in Yonkers on the night of the kidnapping.
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Post by sue75 on Apr 9, 2012 9:43:55 GMT -5
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Post by bookrefuge on Apr 9, 2012 11:27:20 GMT -5
Thanks, Sue. This looks pretty weak. The information given here is no stronger than that which appeared in many false leads after the kidnapping. It says some German guys in the Bronx mentioned “Englewood,” but doesn’t say they mentioned the Lindberghs or a kidnapping? One of the guys looked kind of like Cemetery John, and there were some handwriting similarities? That could apply to maybe a million people? Hauptmann didn’t even go by “Bruno” in the US, unless they’re suggesting he fell back on that name for the crime. I thought Zorn was going to give us some dynamite—and maybe he will--but so far, at least, this sounds more like the sound of a child’s balloon being popped.
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on Apr 9, 2012 12:43:27 GMT -5
I would encourage everyone to give Bob Zorn's new book a read. I had several very long conversations with him and I was impressed by his open mindedness. More importantly though, I believe that even if the specific characters involved according to his book are flawed, the move toward a more realistic scenario which involves BRH and close confederates is a move closer toward the truth and away from some of the more imaginative and fantastic theories regarding this case.
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Post by Michael on Jun 1, 2012 18:06:54 GMT -5
Website promoting the book: cemeteryjohn.com/I haven't read it. I do think I will buy it just so that I can learn about the Experts positions concerning the Suspect and the characteristics they are identifying with the actual Criminal. This way I might be able to link that information up with someone in the files. Feel free to call be biased, but there's no way I can believe that whoever was involved wasn't mentioned somehow, someway, and/or somewhere in the hundreds of thousands of documents the Law Enforcement, Private Investigators, and Governor Hoffman had assembled. People were turning in their own kin on the mere hunch they were involved. If anyone reads it before I do I will be anxious to see what you think about this book.
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Post by sue75 on Jun 1, 2012 23:17:11 GMT -5
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on Jun 2, 2012 9:08:06 GMT -5
I hope everyone gets to read this new book. Bob is a great guy and I enjoyed our many conversations. If nothing else it has been the genesis for a project that may change a lot of opinions about this case.
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mairi
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Post by mairi on Jun 2, 2012 10:40:45 GMT -5
Kevkon, I went to Amazon and found a Zorn book entitled Cemetery JohnIs this the book you mean? Couldn't find one called Cradle to Grave. Thanx ahead.
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Post by kit on Jun 2, 2012 12:12:40 GMT -5
As the book's introduction at cemeteryjohn.com states, "a fifteen-year-old boy from the Bronx, unwittingly witnesses two German immigrant neighbors of his conspiring with a man named “Bruno” to kidnap the infant son of world famous aviator."
Didn't those who were friendly with BRH refer to him as Richard, or am I mistaken about that?
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Post by Michael on Jun 2, 2012 15:15:16 GMT -5
You're right Kit. I've also seen him referred to as "Dick" sometimes too but never "Bruno."
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on Jun 2, 2012 15:37:55 GMT -5
Kevkon, I went to Amazon and found a Zorn book entitled Cemetery JohnIs this the book you mean? Couldn't find one called Cradle to Grave. Thanx ahead. Yes, that's it Mairi. I guess they changed the title for some reason.
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Post by bookrefuge on Jun 3, 2012 13:48:12 GMT -5
A couple of up-front remarks about Zorn’s book.
On the website, he has a picture of John Knoll next to a sketch of “Cemetery John” and indeed there is a strong resemblance. This is, it might be mentioned, what Michael calls the “evolved” sketch and not the first one, which seems to resemble Knoll a bit less.
I expect Anna Hauptmann and BRH’s friends were familiar with the “Cemetery John” sketches. If that’s the case, and John Knoll was a friend of BRH, I’m surprised Anna and the others didn’t look at the pictures, gasp and say, “Why, isn’t that John Knoll?” Now it could be argued that Knoll was just a fleeting acquaintance of Hauptmann, and therefore Anna and the others in their circle didn’t know him. But if that’s the case, would BRH go to the electric chair to save someone who wasn’t even a close friend?
Another thing that bugs me. From what I’ve read so far, Zorn’s father was at Palisades Park and he overheard Knoll talking in German to a man called “Bruno,” and they mentioned “Englewood.” I believe that’s the extent of it--so far, I haven’t heard that there was any mention of “Lindbergh.” Now I’m not from the New York-New Jersey area, but isn’t Englewood practically next to Palisades Park? So it would hardly be unusual to hear someone at Palisades Park mention “Englewood.” If they talked about “Hopewell,” “Lindbergh” and “baby,” it would be far more impressive. The other thing—as noted in the posts above-- Hauptmann didn’t go by “Bruno” in the US. If I recall correctly, Anna said she didn’t hear that name used for him until the publicity following his arrest. I wonder if the Zorns were aware of that.
I realize, of course, that there’s a whole lot more to Zorn’s thesis, and I look forward to reading his book.
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on Jun 3, 2012 15:56:41 GMT -5
I would say that if Knoll did indeed meet Hauptmann at Palisades Park and called him Bruno, then they certainly were not friends as such called him Dick or Richard. I suppose it's possible that Bruno could have been used as a cover. I also don't know if Bob Zorn is claiming they were friends or it was just business.
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Post by wolf2 on Jun 3, 2012 18:07:20 GMT -5
i know when the police interviewed guys he worked with they called him dick
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Post by jdanniel on Jun 4, 2012 16:20:02 GMT -5
I'm a New Jersey resident. Just to give everyone a geographic frame of reference, Hopewell is about an hour and a half south of Englewood.
Jd
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Post by sue75 on Jun 12, 2012 22:18:50 GMT -5
Blog on Zorn's new book. And someone's claim that their grandfather was a reporter for the Journal American and was the first to arrive on the kidnap scene to witness Lindbergh. This blogger says his grandfather, the reporter, claimed the butler did it. Oh, well. www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2894584/posts
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Post by sue75 on Jun 12, 2012 22:23:33 GMT -5
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Post by Michael on Jun 13, 2012 7:24:23 GMT -5
Good find Sue.
I've read the account of a Reporter stumbling onto to Lindbergh that night. If you are interested I could try to find out who it was. If my memory serves me it was Sam Blackman. He was in this thing from beginning to end. And when I say end I mean all the way up to the day he died. He knew a lot, and it would be a good interview if this was really his relative to see what he said privately about the subject.
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Post by wolf2 on Jun 14, 2012 20:05:24 GMT -5
just got zorns new book, i find it interesting, but i cant buy the knoll point of view. just not enough evidence. its well written and i like the experts he brought into the mix to discuss differnt things
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Post by sue75 on Jun 14, 2012 22:53:51 GMT -5
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kevkon
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Post by kevkon on Jun 15, 2012 6:59:46 GMT -5
Thanks Steve, hopefully you will see more of this on PBS Nova.
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Post by Michael on Jun 15, 2012 16:01:07 GMT -5
Associated Press.... Unless two Reporters ran into Lindbergh in the same way then it was him: Since I already believe I know who was behind it, why it happened, and some of what happened - I won't be too receptive to Knoll being who 12 years of research tells me he wasn't. The most I could possibly buy is that he was hired to do "something" associated - like Perrone was hired to deliver the note to Condon by whoever that was who got cold feet and passed it off on him. I am very interested to see what the Experts say about certain things however. Like the Ransom Notes, and personality profiles... I cannot wait for the Nova episode!!!!!
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