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Post by scathma on Apr 2, 2019 9:24:03 GMT -5
In 1932, legendary news reporter Samuel G. Blackman broke the story of the Crime of the Century, that the one-year-old son of famed aviator Charles Lindbergh had been kidnapped. Blackman covered the story through the investigation, arrest, trial and execution of lone suspect, Bruno Hauptmann. Blackman eventually became the top editor at The Associated Press. Now, 87 years later, his grandson and host of Travel Channel's new series "Mission Declassified," Christof Putzel re-examines a puzzling mystery: did the immigrant carpenter, Hauptmann, have accomplices? In an upcoming episode of the series, Putzel uses declassified documents not available to his grandfather, evidence stored at the New Jersey Police Museum and help from archivists and experts around the globe, to uncover Hauptmann's co-conspirators. Tune in to "Mission Declassified" - The Lindbergh Kidnapping - on Sunday, April 7 at 10 p.m. ET/PT on Travel Channel. www.broadwayworld.com/bwwtv/article/Scoop-Coming-Up-On-All-New-MISSION-DECLASSIFIED-On-The-Travel-Channel-Sunday-April-7-2019-20190401
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Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2019 10:43:14 GMT -5
Thanks for posting this scathma. I am really looking forward to learning what Putzel has uncovered in his research. Was BRH, while living in Germany involved in any political activities? Did the NJSP, NYPD or FBI look for such connections? Maybe Putzel will have some answers. We shall see!
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Post by hurtelable on Apr 3, 2019 19:21:23 GMT -5
After digesting the commonly known information about Hauptmann, I really don't know what political movement in Germany he might have been connected to when he left for the US c. 1923. Although that was a politically turbulent era in German history, with extremist groups like Nazis and communists vying for power while a republican government held a tenuous grip, I do not know of any evidence that Hauptmann was affiliated with any violence-prone political party organization., either in Germany or the US. His connections with Jewish associates like Fisch just about rules out any consideration that Hauptmann was pro-Nazi.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2019 15:19:39 GMT -5
His connections with Jewish associates like Fisch just about rules out any consideration that Hauptmann was pro-Nazi. This is a very good point, Hurt. I wonder if Christof Putzel considered this while he was doing his research. I think its important.
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Post by Michael on Apr 8, 2019 7:18:27 GMT -5
I got a chance to watch the show last night. I enjoyed it. Glad everyone got to see the note overlay on top of the table piece. As a reminder... The NJSP were looking for a template for these holes their entire investigation. Once Hauptmann was arrested they scrutinized everything in his possession as a potential template. They even thought they found it at one point but it didn't match up. So for someone to write that confession on top of something that "worked" makes it worthy of consideration. The confession itself could be a misdirect, a hoax, or what have you but it shows someone did their homework and was able to find something the Police didn't seem to be able to do.
I've seen others say since the NJSP didn't "investigate" that table piece somehow "proves" it was a Hoax. That could only come from those who haven't properly researched the case. That's all I can say about that excuse because its weak and quite frankly silly. No offense but it truly is. I've also seen some say that this writer read Haring's book, somehow blew up the photo of the note from that book to scale, then began searching for something like this table piece AND finding it - as an explanation. I've always rejected that idea but I guess its in the eye of the beholder. I'm sure that's possible right? But what other circumstances support it? I mean if this was a "hoax," I cannot understand why it was hidden and why they did not point out the holes since that's what 'should' validate the entire thing.
Another thing is the confession itself. I don't view it in any way as a claim that Hauptmann was "innocent" or that he was a Nazi. It appears to me that whoever wrote it is trying to pass himself off as one. I know there's people who reject the idea that the crime was perpetrated by the NSDAP. They also reject Lindbergh was involved as well. But there is no doubt that Lindbergh identified with much of the philosophies associated with them. Just read Anne's Wave of the Future. I don't personally believe this had anything to do with the NSDAP. But that's just me. However, I think its a huge mistake to "shut down" any potential angle without first looking into it. Know what I mean? Years ago I had the privilege of sitting down with a real Nazi Hunter and USDOJ Nazi Prosecutor with a group of Lindbergh Researchers. They were interested in several things I had and I learned from them considering their perspective. There was no proof of anything but it was all about potential and information which we ALL learned from.
As far as Giessler goes... I've got quite a bit on him in V3. As I've made clear before - I think there's "something" to Document Examination. I really do. However, I personally find it less reliable than a Lie Detector. I'd hate to be innocent of a crime and see one of them sitting on the Prosecution's side claiming I wrote something I did not. And there's no doubt in my mind they could find one to do so if they searched long enough.
Anyway again - I enjoyed the show. I don't think we can rate these things based upon our own personal beliefs and should try not to do that. What did everyone else think?
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Post by wolfman666 on Apr 8, 2019 9:44:42 GMT -5
didn't like the show this guy was on one railroad track, instead of getting a handwriting expert, how about dating the table with a furniture expert so once and for all we can know if it is in the time frame of the case. he went all the way to Germany to ask about his arrest record when they have it in the archives. he did more then steal a loaf of bread. and this nonsense he goes to the house and he figured everything out that's getting old. in the eighties they had people from both sides of the case in the segment. its to one sided these last few segments.
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Post by Michael on Apr 8, 2019 10:51:21 GMT -5
didn't like the show this guy was on one railroad track, instead of getting a handwriting expert, how about dating the table with a furniture expert so once and for all we can know if it is in the time frame of the case. he went all the way to Germany to ask about his arrest record when they have it in the archives. he did more then steal a loaf of bread. and this nonsense he goes to the house and he figured everything out that's getting old. in the eighties they had people from both sides of the case in the segment. its to one sided these last few segments. That's a good point about trying to date the table. We don't know that he didn't try though. Perhaps he did try but was told it wasn't possible? I see the show from the perspective of someone reacting to this find for the first time then making an attempt to figure it all out. Of course you or I might proceed differently if creating a show - or at least we think we would. I mean that flight to Germany didn't happen during the hour long episode so obviously there's a lot more which he did that is still sitting on the cutting room floor. In the end this table gets exposure, the case gets highlighted, and hopefully more research occurs because of it. BTW: Mark really is that nice. He's very personable and knows everything there is to know about whatever you might be interested in. So what you saw on that program was no acting job. For anyone considering giving him a call with questions and/or requests this is the person who will pick up the phone. And for those thinking about a visit you should know this is the friendly guy who will be waiting to see you.
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Post by Joe on Apr 8, 2019 11:48:41 GMT -5
didn't like the show this guy was on one railroad track, instead of getting a handwriting expert, how about dating the table with a furniture expert so once and for all we can know if it is in the time frame of the case. he went all the way to Germany to ask about his arrest record when they have it in the archives. he did more then steal a loaf of bread. and this nonsense he goes to the house and he figured everything out that's getting old. in the eighties they had people from both sides of the case in the segment. its to one sided these last few segments. That's a good point about trying to date the table. We don't know that he didn't try though. Perhaps he did try but was told it wasn't possible? I see the show from the perspective of someone reacting to this find for the first time then making an attempt to figure it all out. Of course you or I might proceed differently if creating a show - or at least we think we would. I mean that flight to Germany didn't happen during the hour long episode so obviously there's a lot more which he did that is still sitting on the cutting room floor. In the end this table gets exposure, the case gets highlighted, and hopefully more research occurs because of it. BTW: Mark really is that nice. He's very personable and knows everything there is to know about whatever you might be interested in. So what you saw on that program was no acting job. For anyone considering giving him a call with questions and/or requests this is the person who will pick up the phone. And for those thinking about a visit you should know this is the friendly guy who will be waiting to see you.
Very nicely and diplomatically put Michael. But this was one hack piece of investigative reporting, and a real wild goose chase throughout. So why not just call it that? You've made the point before that these enterprises sometimes don't even scratch the surface. Well, what you saw was this show's bottom line message. It was very clear, and it was a debacle.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2019 12:03:23 GMT -5
I thought the show was just OK. I could be wrong here but I thought Putzel's foundation for this show was to present a connection between Hauptmann, the Nazi party and the kidnapping of Charlie. I failed to see any of that materialize as I watched this show.
I did enjoy the Mersman table part at the archives and how precisely the holes of the notes line up with the table brace. Not being involved with furniture building, I don't know if other tables built at the time this one was might also have holes that align with the ransom note holes. I also would like to have a furniture expert look at the table as far as dating it is concerned. I have not looked at this piece of evidence yet so I can't really comment any further on it.
i think Putzel's trip to Germany was not worth the time and money it must have cost. No doubt a phone call to Germany's archives would have informed him that they could not allow him to research if Hauptmann had a Nazi connection because you must be a blood relative to the person you want to learn about.
Like Steve said in his post, the NJSP archives could have told Putzel all he needed to know about Hauptmann's German crime record. The way Hauptmann's record was downplayed as stealing only "a loaf of bread" was a complete misrepresentation of the true facts of his crime spree in Germany. Also, the two German gentlemen Putzel was talking with about BRH's crime record said that Hauptmann's mother caused BRH to confess his crimes to the German authorities. What record does that come from? If you check Hauptmann's autobiography(of all places) concerning this, he is very clear that he and Fritz Petzold were planning to leave town and go elsewhere when they were apprehended. I doubt very much that Hauptmann's mother turned them in!
I think the point made about Hauptmann not working alone when committing crimes is an important point and should be given consideration when looking at the Lindbergh kidnapping and Hauptmann's attachment to it.
I am looking forward to what Michael's volume 3 will say about the Faulkner angle. The handwriting specialist consulted for this program says there is a match between Geissler's handwriting and the Faulkner deposit slip because of the way the "t" was written. If I am recalling correctly, he also thought Geissler's more extensive handwriting exemplars connected him to the J.J. Faulkner letter Gov. Hoffman received. I did happen to read at the archives a report on Geissler's handwriting. It seems that at first it was thought Geissler wrote the Faulkner deposit slip but this was reversed later and he was ruled out.
So on which side of the fence does Geissler's handwriting actually fall?? This exemplifies what I see as a real weakness in this "science". It is not really exact in its findings since QDE's do interpret the same handwriting samples differently from each other.
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Post by allison on Apr 8, 2019 15:24:37 GMT -5
I just watched it (twice) and really enjoyed it. I liked the host’s personal angle to the case. It’s always interesting to see material saved from those close to the case such as an AP reporter. And while they didn’t follow through with the insider-as-accomplice theory, it was nice to see the table again, the JJ Faulkner piece and, as Amy said, the reminder that Hauptmann liked to work with others. Thumbs up for the program’s shift away from the usual Condon/ransom drop/body discovery focus.
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Post by stella7 on Apr 8, 2019 19:20:44 GMT -5
Michael, I bet someone from Rago in Lambertville could identify or date the Mersman table. They're very knowledgeable. We went to one of their free appraisal days once and learned tons about the pieces we had.
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Post by Michael on Apr 9, 2019 7:53:20 GMT -5
Very nicely and diplomatically put Michael. But this was one hack piece of investigative reporting, and a real wild goose chase throughout. So why not just call it that? You've made the point before that these enterprises sometimes don't even scratch the surface. Well, what you saw was this show's bottom line message. It was very clear, and it was a debacle. Gee whiz Joe. Anyone wondering where I was last night? Well, after reading Joe's post, I curled up in a ball and cried myself to sleep. And it was that smiley face that pushed me over the edge! (Sigh) Michael, I bet someone from Rago in Lambertville could identify or date the Mersman table. They're very knowledgeable. We went to one of their free appraisal days once and learned tons about the pieces we had. I am pretty sure I tried that source believe it or not. Back when the discovery was first made there was a lot of attempts to date the table. Joe & I (independently) both sent out email to certain experts. I even got/get email from time to time from people who stumble onto posts about it on this Board. Sue made the trip to Ohio to tour the factory. Etc. etc. etc. It just seemed like everything had to do with the tag/stamp on the table and that isn't on the piece which was turned over. So I've basically given up on it. Most email exchanges I've had are in my "Mersman" file and as always I can't seem to find where I filed it. I am going to try to find it again later... its there so its just a matter of time.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 8:17:40 GMT -5
It just seemed like everything had to do with the tag/stamp on the table and that isn't on the piece which was turned over. This is an important fact in not only dating the table but identifying it as a true Mersman table. Mersman furniture was stamped as such with a number included as part of that stamp. If this table is unmarked as you say, then it probably is not a true Mersman table. This makes it even more important to have it evaluated by an antiques dealer. Here is a link to a good article about Mersman furniture which includes a picture of the stamp used by this manufacturer. www.antiquetrader.com/featured/mersman-tables-remain-a-staple-of-20th-century-colonial-revival-furniture/
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Post by Michael on Apr 9, 2019 8:25:31 GMT -5
That's a good link Amy and you are doing what I'd expect anyone with interest to do. Here is Mark's email about the discovery for anyone who hasn't seen it yet:
As I remember the table itself would consist of three parts. The Top. The Base. And the connecting piece in the middle. What is at the NJSP Archives is that connecting piece. Going from memory at the moment ... that stamp is on one of the other two pieces. Its a mystery. The problem is that there is so much to research about ANY angle of this case - right? So if one decides to go "all in" on this piece it could take up a lot of time. And in the end it could be a complete hoax. So I think its natural for most to shy away from investing that amount of time with the potential being it could end up all being for naught.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2019 10:51:11 GMT -5
As I remember the table itself would consist of three parts. The Top. The Base. And the connecting piece in the middle. What is at the NJSP Archives is that connecting piece. Going from memory at the moment ... that stamp is on one of the other two pieces. Its a mystery. The problem is that there is so much to research about ANY angle of this case - right? So if one decides to go "all in" on this piece it could take up a lot of time. And in the end it could be a complete hoax. So I think its natural for most to shy away from investing that amount of time with the potential being it could end up all being for naught. First, thanks for posting the link to Mark's wonderful post about the table. He is such an excellent source for information and his post sure proves that! Second, I am both shocked and distressed to learn from you that the rest of the table is not at the archives. So it appears there is no way to positively identify if the table brace is actually from a Mersman table. Still, I do think the message written is intriguing either way. The fact that the NJSP kept this piece gives it importance. Mark's discovery of the precise match to the ransom notes elevates its importance considerably. No written reports at the archives on this. UGH!!!
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Post by Joe on Apr 9, 2019 13:39:34 GMT -5
Michael.. at least you probably didn't almost choke on your dinner watching on Sunday evening, like I did.
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Post by wolfman666 on Apr 10, 2019 11:07:47 GMT -5
don't know what mike means about going all in, to date the table cant take to much time
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Post by hurtelable on Apr 10, 2019 11:13:47 GMT -5
What do you guys make of handwriting expert in "Mission Declassified" identifying Carl O. Giessler - whose wife's maiden name was Jane Faulkner - as "J. J. Faulkner? I suppose it depends on how much you think of forensic handwriting analysis in general. I had previously been thinking that "J. J. Faulkner" was Jacob J. Nosovitsky, as per Noel Behn's book.
The argument here for Giessler being a hot suspect is about the only facet of the case where the documentary delivers (or tries to deliver) "hot" new information that was pretty much off the radar previously.
Also noteworthy is the complete omission of the name of Isador Fisch. Wonder why? Could it be that Hauptmann's friendship with Fisch (Jewish) pretty much debunks the theory of Hauptmann being Nazi-connected. As it is, the documentary comes up empty in trying to link the Nazi party to the case, except if you believe that the Mersman table is more than a hoax.
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Post by Michael on Apr 10, 2019 14:15:21 GMT -5
Michael.. at least you probably didn't almost choke on your dinner watching on Sunday evening, like I did. Thanks for that Joe. You don't know how hard I laughed when I read that. What do you guys make of handwriting expert in "Mission Declassified" identifying Carl O. Giessler - whose wife's maiden name was Jane Faulkner - as "J. J. Faulkner? I have a good amount of material on Giessler in V3. I will say that many Germans wrote similarly. My opinion is there is "something" to QDEs but its not a true "science." I put it a notch below Lie Detectors. Most email exchanges I've had are in my "Mersman" file and as always I can't seem to find where I filed it. I am going to try to find it again later... its there so its just a matter of time. Well I found the file but none of my email exchanges are in it! They exist I just don't know where at the moment. However, something I had forgotten about WAS in the file... Ever since this table piece was discovered I always kept my eyes open for something in the files at the NJSP Archives. This report below was the ONLY thing I found in the entire place. I know. I'm not saying it IS related but it was the only thing even close. Needless to say we are flying blind concerning this evidence. However, as I wrote on the other Board: If this table was found in Hauptmann's apartment by police after his arrest it would have been a State's Exhibit at Trial for SURE. NO DOUBT IN MY MIND.
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Post by Joe on Apr 11, 2019 11:14:46 GMT -5
Michael, it actually happened during one of the many times I had to laugh out loud during the show.. I suppose it didn't help I was having spicy Thai chili chicken for dinner at the time!
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Post by Michael on Apr 12, 2019 8:30:25 GMT -5
Michael, it actually happened during one of the many times I had to laugh out loud during the show.. I suppose it didn't help I was having spicy Thai chili chicken for dinner at the time! Okay now you're just trying to make me hungry.
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Post by Michael on Apr 15, 2019 9:03:49 GMT -5
Just want to go over something as it pertains to the table piece. As everyone knows I am undecided about it. I think its a normal approach for anyone to think they could either replicate "how" it may have been done and if not then it was never used in any way. This is a flawed position. I encourage everyone to consider possibilities but if one cannot do it themselves that in no way means it cannot be done. (Similarly, if one can that does mean it was either.) I've given a Rubix Cube as an example of this. Most people cannot solve it. And yet an elite few can. People have abilities and experiences others do not. These things must be a consideration too. Were they incarcerated? Were they in a war? Were they an attorney? Were they a doctor? Were they LE? Were they in the CIA working on code breaking? Look at Zodiac. They could never figure out who he was ... does that mean he did not exist? I'm going to give another of my personal examples... Among my strengths at work was my ability to find things. I once found a fake ceiling anchor made of wood instead of cast iron used to conceal of wall safe. It was a work of ART. Now while I could find it that doesn't mean I could replicate it. And on the other side of things who ever built it believed no one would have the ability to find it. So what do you think their reaction to my discovery was? Of course - that someone had "snitched." But no one did. Another time I found a fake "block" in a wall. I marveled at the brilliance behind its creation. For real. I can truly say I admired the ability of whoever made it under the circumstances because I don't know "how" and I know I could never do that myself. Unfortunately for whoever did though, I was one of two or three guys that would be able discover it. And I happened to be there so I did. So sit me down and tell me to show you how it was made to prove my story and I cannot. And even if I could it still doesn't mean my story is true - does it? There's too many variables to consider and unless something new is discovered I don't know how we are going to prove or disprove this thing.
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Post by scathma on Apr 15, 2019 11:52:42 GMT -5
I did enjoy the Mersman table part at the archives and how precisely the holes of the notes line up with the table brace. Not being involved with furniture building, I don't know if other tables built at the time this one was might also have holes that align with the ransom note holes. I also would like to have a furniture expert look at the table as far as dating it is concerned. I have not looked at this piece of evidence yet so I can't really comment any further on it. In this 2015 interview, Richard Cahill stated the following: www.annmarieackermann.com/the-table-block-confession-in-the-lindbergh-kidnapping/Q: What is the significance of the holes in the wood matching to the holes in the note?
RC: In my opinion, it shows that while the table top confession was likely not a genuine article. the holes in the ransom notes match the industry standard for these types of tables. The kidnapper used something very similar as a template for the ransom notes. A carpenter would certainly have access to and knowledge of something like this. (emphasis added) If such an "industry standard for these types of tables" existed, then it would suggest that some hoaxer made the connection between table braces and the ransom note symbol. As Michael describes above, if you possess a unique skill or perspective, you see table brace holes in the singnature, not ink bottle outlines. Add a German sailor song to the mix to provide an air of authenticity (somewhat diminshed by misspelling "Hamberg") and sit back and wait for someone to "discover" the clue to whodunit and where there may be ransom money hidden!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2019 16:38:06 GMT -5
In this 2015 interview, Richard Cahill stated the following: www.annmarieackermann.com/the-table-block-confession-in-the-lindbergh-kidnapping/Q: What is the significance of the holes in the wood matching to the holes in the note?
RC: In my opinion, it shows that while the table top confession was likely not a genuine article. the holes in the ransom notes match the industry standard for these types of tables. The kidnapper used something very similar as a template for the ransom notes. A carpenter would certainly have access to and knowledge of something like this. (emphasis added) If such an "industry standard for these types of tables" existed, then it would suggest that some hoaxer made the connection between table braces and the ransom note symbol. As Michael describes above, if you possess a unique skill or perspective, you see table brace holes in the singnature, not ink bottle outlines. Add a German sailor song to the mix to provide an air of authenticity (somewhat diminshed by misspelling "Hamberg") and sit back and wait for someone to "discover" the clue to whodunit and where there may be ransom money hidden! In trying to understand all this, are you saying that someone who worked at a furniture factory (in this case Mersman Table Co. of Salina, Ohio) thought the table brace holes suggested to them the holes in the ransom notes, so that person wrote the message on there as a hoax? Elmer Boilard bought the table new in 1940 so that limits the number of persons who had access to this particular table. Are you suggesting that Elmer Boilard, who had worked at a machine shop in Plainfield, NJ, and the friend Boilard took the table brace to, who must have known how to read and write German, made a mental connection with the ransom note holes and these men put that message on there as a hoax, not realizing that such an item might actually have been a template for the ransom hole notes as Cahill suggests? Someone years later made the same mental connection to table brace holes as was done by the Lindbergh baby kidnappers?? Is that why there is such a precise measurement between the brace holes and the ransom note holes? It is just a lucky coincidence and that is all? The misspelling of Hamburg is very suspicious, as you and another poster noted earlier. I agree that it is not likely a German would have made that mistake. Something to give consideration to as well when evaluating this item.
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Post by scathma on Apr 16, 2019 13:07:50 GMT -5
I posted the Cahill exchange to share his assertion that the hole spacing was, as he put it "an industry standard." If that is true (and I'm not saying it is) then not only is any of the myriad Mersman tables in circulation a possible template, but so are any of the tables from other makers using this "industry standard" spacing. If standard spacing is true, there could have been a table at Highfields (awaiting assembly as the family was in the process of moving in right?), 2974 Decatur Avenue, 1279 E. 222nd Street or elsewhere that could have had a viable table-related template based on that standard.
It's far less a lucky coincidence if that brace spacing isn't as unique as it would first appear. For example, let's say I create a secret symbol with five punched holes. A mechanic sees my symbol in the paper and realizes that the spacing of my supposedly unique symbol turns out to match the bolt hole spacing on a 2003 Dodge pick-up rim. There are 5 holes in the rim and the center of each hole is 5.5 inches center-to-center from the next. So we now know that the creator of the symbol must have used a 2003 Dodge truck rim as the template. Except that the hole spacing isn't unique to the 2003 model, nor is it even unique to Dodge. Dodge has used that spacing for years, as well as other brands too. So all we have established is that, of all the possible items to use as a symbol template, any wheel with a 5 x 5.5 bolt pattern is a possible match and not to the exclusion of any other object.
My comments do not imply that Boilard, his friend or a factory employee perpetrated this likely hoax. History is full of frauds and hoaxes, some relying on a few well-placed "facts" to lend an air of authenticity to an ultimately bogus claim. After all, it was the sailor song that led to the brace, not the other way around, correct? So what better way to sell the message and hopefully point to the clue than to pick a German song, write the lyrics in German (why? because Hauptmann was German of course) only to ultimately drop the ball by misspelling "Hamburg." Would an American misspell the title and lyrics to "Amerika, The Beautiful"? Must one be able to read and write German to write a few sentences, misspelling notwithstanding? As Mark Falzini noted, the handwriting is not German handwriting and there are mistakes in the message that a native German speaker would not make.
So who did write on the table? Could a table leave the factory in Ohio with the writing already on it, past any final quality check? Were the pieces shipped assembled or in pieces? (I assume crated for shipping efficiency and protection) There is the potential for quite a few hands accessing the piece from factory, to warehouse, to distributor, to furniture store, to haulage company, to final buyer. Where in that chain did our clever prankster intervene?
How long was the lead time from manufacture to purchase? If Boilard bought the piece new in 1940, is the inference that the piece was built only a few weeks/months earlier? If so, what was the significance of writing that message in 1939/40 when Hauptmann was long dead, the case already well wound down, the ransom money supposedly all accounted for, not in Summit NJ? Surely the table wasn't built and inscribed in the early to mid 30's, proximate to the crime, only to languish unsold with it's cryptic message until it was discovered long after the writer intended?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2019 17:11:24 GMT -5
I posted the Cahill exchange to share his assertion that the hole spacing was, as he put it "an industry standard." If that is true (and I'm not saying it is) then not only is any of the myriad Mersman tables in circulation a possible template, but so are any of the tables from other makers using this "industry standard" spacing. If standard spacing is true, there could have been a table at Highfields (awaiting assembly as the family was in the process of moving in right?), 2974 Decatur Avenue, 1279 E. 222nd Street or elsewhere that could have had a viable table-related template based on that standard. I totally agree with this. It is why I had questioned whether another table might have been the source for the hole template and not necessarily a Mersman. The only thing that really suggests that a table was involved to begin with is that the ransom note holes are a measurement match to the Mersman table brace that Boilard had. This wasn't even picked up on by the authorities (as far as we know because there are no reports!) and only came to light because Mark Falzini made that mental connection to hole placement and ransom note holes. Why was this German message written on that table brace considering it is not that large of an item and it was in a place where you are not likely to notice it easily. That table brace was part of a Mersman tier table. The message brace would have been on the underside of the lower tier as the center hole of the brace was used for a bolt to pass through to attach the top tier and the lower tier sections together. The fact that Summit NJ is mentioned and the board message is signed N.S.D.A.P. is something to consider about who might have written that message. Would it make the writer someone who knew the table was headed for New Jersey to be sold or even more specifically it would be sold in Plainfield NJ? Or does this point to the writer as someone who lived in New Jersey and knew about the history of the German American Bund that had been active in the Andover NJ area in 1937 since the message is saying the NSDAP was the responsible party for the kidnapping. www.njherald.com/story/25173194/andovers-hillside-park-was-once-camp-nordland?template=art_printSummit NJ is southeast of the Andover area and Plainsfield NJ a bit to the south of Summit NJ. How likely is it that a table that had its origins in Celina, Ohio would end up with information on it that ties nicely with New Jersey history? UGH, handwriting issues again! The QDE on the recent Lindbergh case special with Christof Putzel, said he thought the table brace writing was done by a German. So what ARE we to believe about this handwriting??
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2019 7:37:23 GMT -5
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Post by Michael on Apr 17, 2019 8:45:11 GMT -5
I posted the Cahill exchange to share his assertion that the hole spacing was, as he put it "an industry standard." If that is true (and I'm not saying it is) then not only is any of the myriad Mersman tables in circulation a possible template, but so are any of the tables from other makers using this "industry standard" spacing. If standard spacing is true, there could have been a table at Highfields (awaiting assembly as the family was in the process of moving in right?), 2974 Decatur Avenue, 1279 E. 222nd Street or elsewhere that could have had a viable table-related template based on that standard. First of all good work - its nice to see you pursuing this. Cahill also wrote about this in his book on pages 338-41. He credits a " former director of Sotheby's Appraisals in North America" as telling him the " pattern" was " common" and had been for " a long time." If this is true I agree it is an important fact that can only assist. All I can say is that I asked this question to numerous experts over the years and I never got an answer like this. Unfortunately he didn't name this person and there is no footnote. I'm not saying it isn't true but I'd have several questions to ask before accepting this very general conclusion. Years ago Ronelle sent me a 1932 brochure for Mersman tables. It may have originated with Sue, I'm not sure, but just looking through it there's no way that each connecting piece for the various tables can be the exact same size. So does this Expert know exactly "which" table by looking at the piece itself? Or are they claiming that those holes, despite the size of the table, would be in the exact same place for each and every year of each and every model? See my point? I'm not even sure it was a Duncan Phyfe and we only know by what is in the newspaper articles which Mark has already said cannot be completely trusted. (e.g. one AP article even said the confession was found " in the leg of a table" and another refers to "Celina" as "Salina"). There is that famous picture of it on top of the base too. But that base is not at the Archives. The person who probably did the most leg-work on this angle is a researcher named Steve Lehman. Sometime back in the 90s he visited the factory just like Sue would later do. He spoke with retirees who were still alive at the time and were familiar with all of these tables from hands-on experience. One man in particular saw that picture of the "pedestal" and said it "could" have been a Mersman but wouldn't say so conclusively. Anyway, while I've given up I am glad to see you have not! You've definitely rightly pointed out a potential agreement in philosophy between Richard and myself on this angle - one that I hadn't realized existed before your post. Doesn't make either of us right on this point but its important that it is "out there" for consideration.
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Post by Michael on Apr 17, 2019 10:01:28 GMT -5
Here are the photos of this evidence located at the NJSP Archives: imgur.com/OBLp2tQimgur.com/Vsz6xvSMark tells me that BOTH pieces were originally confiscated by police and belong together.
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Post by Michael on Apr 17, 2019 10:25:23 GMT -5
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